Theatre and Dance Previews

“It’s the funniest thing that I’ve ever been involved in!”

This is quite a statement coming from a man who is well known as a comedian and TV entertainer. So what’s he talking about? Well, King of the Jungle Joe Pasquale is currently starring with veteran comic and actor Russ Abbott in Mel Brooks’ smash-hit musical The Producers.

The West End and multi award-winning Broadway hit has twice been made into a film, firstly with Gene Wilder and more recently with Nathan Lane and Matthew Broderick. But the show is now touring the UK and coming to Milton Keynes this month.

The Producers was a stage show first and ironically mocks the whole business as it follows the diminishing career of a producer Max Bialystock and his accountant Leo Bloom, as they discover that they can make more money out of a theatrical flop than a success. But with the show they put on, Springtime For Hitler, they get more than they bargained for!

I caught up with Joe and Russ to find out why you should go and see them in this award-winning show.

Russ Abbott as De Bris (photo: Catherine Ashmore)

Can you tell me about the show and your roles in it?

Russ: It’s basically a story of a failed plot which is contrived by Max Bialystock and Leo Bloom. Max is a failed producer living on his uppers on Broadway and Leo Bloom is an accountant played by Joe [Pasquale]. He visits Max and they discover when looking over the books that they can make more money with a flop than they can with a hit. So they go out of their way to find the worst play ever written - which is Springtime for Hitler – a gay romp - and the world’s worst director who is a guy called Roger De Bris, the role that I play, and also the worst actors. Then they put them together to hopefully have the world’s biggest flop and raise two million dollars to put the flop on. Then the idea is to run away with the money! But as it happens the show is that bad that it works and it becomes a huge success.

So the show becomes like a cult – you have to see it because it’s so bad?

Joe: Yes - they end up having a big row and Leo does a runner with the money. It’s basically a love story but it’s a love story between Leo and Max more than anything! People don’t see it that way but it is. I remember seeing a Mel Brooks interview years ago when he first put it on Broadway and he said then it’s a love story between Leo and Max. It’s about their relationship but all these bizarre characters come into it to make the show work and it really does work! They end up in prison but it all works out in the end and has a happy ending.

And it’s funny of course?!

Joe: Oh yes – it’s the funniest thing that I’ve ever been involved in. Mel Brooks is just a genius. He was well ahead of his time because when it was first done in 1968 as a movie with Gene Wilder and Zero Mostel, it was only 23 years after the war finished so it was very near, but even now 50 or 60 years after the war is over it’s still very raw to the bone to some people.

And you’re finding that audiences are enjoying it?

Russ: Yes – we’re getting standing ovations, it’s wonderful. And we also get a lot of correspondence from it as well. You get a lot of people who have had a lot of heartache and who thought they’d never go out for a long time but they’re so glad that they did – it breaks the ice and takes the curse off things.

There was one guy who came to see it who was a Jewish Prisoner of War during WW2 and smuggled out during the occupation, but he’d never talked about it. He’d lost family and everything in the camps but he’d laughed so much at the show that oddly enough the following day his wife and he were having a cup of tea and he started to talk about it and blurted it all out and he told her things she never knew had existed in his mind!

This show provides the real magic of theatre then?

Joe: Yes - and the real magic of this show more than anything. Mel Brooks is Jewish and he said the best way of taking somebody down is to laugh at them and that’s exactly what he does with Hitler in this.

Is it difficult when a show has been such a popular film to take on roles like that?

Joe: No, not really, because it was a popular show before it was a popular film, so it was the other way around. It was a successful existing Broadway and West End show so to transpose that onto celluloid was harder than the other way round. For my money I think the film is great, but it doesn’t overtake the live experience of the show.

So if you’ve seen and enjoyed either of the films, you’ll get a whole lot more from this?

Russ: Absolutely yes!

Joe, you’re playing Leo and this is the first musical you’ve ever done isn’t it?! How have you found it?

Joe: It’s alright!! I’ll never make a singer, I’ll never be Michael Ball, and I’ll never be Gene Kelly in the dancing but I find my way through it and I enjoy doing it. I enjoy a challenge and this has certainly been a challenge for me. But as for the acting side of it, I just have to remember 25 years ago. I was working at Smithfields meat market and I wanted to go into show business and that’s what Leo is – an accountant that wants to get into showbusiness, so I relate to that part of the character very much.

I actually saw Russ in a musical 25 years ago called ‘Little Me’ and I was carrying dead cow on my back every day and I thought I don’t want to carry a dead cow on my back anymore, I want to do what Russ does, so I did and here I am 25 years later doing a musical with him!

So you’re working with the man who inspired you? Are you enjoying working together?

Joe: Yes - we only have one scene together really but it’s enough – it’s the bit that we look forward to every night!

Russ: Yes – we have a wonderful rapport, it’s great! It’s a chemistry and it comes across the footlights. I’ve always been a firm believer that if you’re enjoying the part yourself, as an artist, then that will come across and the audience will get hold of that. Even if they like it, they’ll like it even more if they see you enjoying it.

There’s an old saying “If you don’t like the part, then don’t do it”. You should pick and choose and choose the best, and play it to the best, and this is a great, great piece, As Joe said, when you think of the history behind Mel Brooks and his comedy brain, the man’s a genius. You don’t have to touch it, it’s there for you. We don’t have to adapt it, we just have to put ourselves into it and play it, to the best of our abilities.

Russ, tell me about your part?

Russ: I play Roger De Bris – he’s a raving old queen and he’s a lovely character! It’s a challenge. There are no boundaries in theatre really, you take anything on if it’s a good part and a funny part. There’s no truth in the fact that I’m a raving old queen – it’s just the frock I wear!

People sometimes say in interviews you play a transvestite and I say no – it’s a man in a frock! And he’s wearing a frock because he’s going to the choreographer’s ball and there’s prize for the best costume.

Yes, when you first come on you are in a dress, have you acted in a skirt before?

Russ: Well there was Miss Marbles from the series [Russ Abbott’s Madhouse] and others, but with those kind of characters I always used to look like my mum!

You’ve both come from a comic entertaining background and Lee Evans played Leo in the West End. Why do you think that performers with a comedy background are cast rather than someone from a musical theatre route who can just play comedy? Is there a special technique you need?

Russ: Yes you do, you do need a certain amount of experience – it’s the old saying – timing. Joe’s had 25 years in the business now and I’ve had 42 so together there’s a good chemistry there and ability and they [the show’s producers] aren’t stupid. Also, what you need, especially for a tour, is a name on a bill and Joe and I are household names, but Cory English [who plays Max] is certainly going to be a household name! He’s brilliant!

Joe: Yes - he’s the driving force of the show, he’s the battering ram, he blasts his way through it and you just grab hold of his coat tails and hang on for dear life!

It’s a very physical show then?!

Joe: Yes – for everybody, for myself and Cory in particular and all the girls and the lads as well because they all play at least half a dozen parts. Everybody says I can’t believe how many people are in the show and it’s not, they’ve all got about 15 costume changes!

Joe – you were King of the Jungle in “I’m A Celebrity …. Get Me Out of Here". Has that transformed your life in any way?

Joe: Yes – I suppose it has. On a personal level it has because I learned to fly when I came out of there because I was scared of flying before then! But on a career level it has opened up different doors. I did “An Audience With ….” and I’d always dreamt of doing one of those and I never thought I’d get a chance to do that sort of thing. I’ve also done a few movies, and I’ve just done a voice over for a Jim Carrey film – a cartoon. I was always working before it, I was always busy, I was never out of work but it just opened up so many other doors for me.

Russ, would you ever consider reality TV?

Russ: Personally no – at 60 years of age you don’t want to be sitting in the jungle!

You’ve both coming from TV entertainment background – do you both find you’ve got a lot of shared experiences even though there was probably a bit of time between your TV peaks?

Russ: Yes –we do have shared experiences, Joe and I often talk about the club scene which Joe came into it at the back end, and I honestly think that we’ve had the best of the business.

Joe: Yes - I wouldn’t want to come into the business now as a 20-year-old and work my way through because it’s not the same. Even when I came into it all the clubs were big but they’ve now just started dying out because other things have taken over – the Internet, cinema, lapdancing, anything! These clubs are still there but they don’t have the live entertainment they used to have, but the theatre is still here which is why we’re doing this really!

Russ, you’ve done quite a lot of theatre such as Oliver, Chitty Chitty Bang Bang, Dr Dolittle and My Fair Lady. Would you say you enjoyed the live theatre experience more than doing TV?

Russ: It’s a different technique. In television you can repair and re-do and wait forever and be on tenterhooks as to whether it’s going to work because it’s been in the can for three months, but with live entertainment it’s there in your face and you know the experience. If you’re in a good show, like The Producers, you know what response you’re going to get so there’s adrenalin and it’s an excitement to go to work so yes – I do prefer it!

Joe – it may be your first musical but you are used to performing live aren’t you? What do you fancy doing next?

Joe: I don’t know – I quite fancy doing something at the Open Air Theatre in Regent’s Park. I’d love to have a bash at that. I’ve done quite a few plays over the past ten years and friends have done Regents Park so I’d like to have a go at that!

Russ: You’d be good in A Midsummer Night’s Dream – you’d play a great Bottom!

Russ, would you ever go back and do a “Madhouse” special?

Russ: Not now! I’ve played those roles and they were very successful and I was thrilled. I suppose they could put together a compilation maybe but they are very expensive even to repeat apparently. Unfortunately, you can’t get the budget now for those kind of shows. If they did give you the budget then I’m sure that there are a lot of young Russ Abbotts out there – I’d certainly like to see it again.

They can’t afford to make shows like that anymore! They’ve cut back on things and you can’t afford to cut back on light entertainment.

Finally then, what would you say to people to encourage them to come to see The Producers?

Russ: It’s got all the ingredients, it’s a great night out at the theatre and it’s a brand new experience for people who’ve never been to the theatre. And if you have been before, you may have seen My Fair Lady, The Sound of Music, 42nd Street and Cats, you name it, but this is in a different category, it’s comedy. My Fair Lady has got the romance and the charm, but this is pure, unadulterated humour and it hits you right in the face and it’s belly laughs all the way!

Joe: Yes – some comedies you go and see and while they are amusing you don’t really laugh at them, but right from the word go in this, as soon as Cory comes on, you’re laughing all the way through for two and a half hours!

Russ: Yes – it’s a pleasure to go to work, you think I’m looking forward to today and you gear your life around it and you gear yourself up for the performance because it’s demanding and you want to be your best when you get on there.

So if you’re fed up – this is the show to come to then?

Joe: Absolutely – it’s the only place to come! Life is quite depressing at the moment, you’ve only got to turn the telly on and see the news, the recent floods, and the wars and if you want to have two and a half hours to just forget your troubles and laugh your head off, this is the place to come and see it.

Russ: I couldn’t top that – it’s an absolutely perfect synopsis. It really is a belter, we wouldn’t be in it if it wasn’t!